How Joshua Harris Went From $2,000 /month To $340,000 /month

Alright hey everyone and Sam Evans here and today I’ve got Josh Harris on with us and Josh Harris is one of our customers since like way back since when I first got started and he’s got an awesome story he’s one of our seven-figure case studies one of the first ones we had and Josh joint Josh started working with me back in was it 2014 seems like so long ago now and back then when he joined he was making around like $2,000 per month and he was just doing like website jobs for different businesses and stuff and it was kind of scrappy and kind of doing one thing for this person one thing for this person kind of how most people get started when they’re doing you know website projects for people and since then you know it’s been it’s been like four years since then and he’s gone from 2 grand a month to the point now where he’s making consistently about 250,000 per month which is you know that’s like 3 million dollars per year and still growing quickly so this is one of our seven figure case studies and what we’re going to do is we’re going to like drill in and see exactly how that happened but how do you go from making 2 grand a month to making 250 grand a month so welcome Josh and first of all congrats on getting to seven figures and looking forward to digging into your story cool man try to be here so let’s start with what was going on back in 2014 when you joined it you’re making two grand a month what were you doing back then yeah I mean I might back up a little bit earlier just to like set some context for that time but when I first you know kind of growing up I had my first business with my brother when I was like 12 and that was when I was hooked because I was like hey you know instead of getting paid hourly you can like do this thing and you know get paid to do it and I wasn’t tied to how much time you put in it was tied to like you know how fast you could do it and if you did the job great so that was like my first taste at 12 and so I was like I don’t think I want to have a job I think I want to do you know this entrepreneur thing I didn’t know what it was called back then so you know that was kind of the seeds of what led me up to that point and so throughout my teenage years I did all sorts of crazy stuff like raking leaves or even a failed dog waste removal company because that never got any traction and so I tried all those things and then you know even went through some MLM stuff and then around you know 18 19 I really realized that you know the future was really internet those were all the opportunity was that’s where all these rich people and successful people were popping up is they had some connection to the Internet and so you know I enjoy talking with people I kind of had you know enjoyed sales I enjoyed psychology and the internet just seemed like this amazing selling platform so that’s kind of where I just started dabbling because there wasn’t really any roadmap or you know playbook for a lot of this stuff so you know did websites for people I would know or did some marketing stuff but didn’t really understand the concept of you know a proof of concept and having something that you could consistently and repeatedly make work and so I didn’t know that I was looking for that but that’s kind of what I was trying to figure out you know I just didn’t have a word for it it’s like what is how can I find some consistency because it just felt all over the place with what we were doing so when I found you stuff that was kind of where I was at I tried a lot of different things and just was really difficult to get anything to scale consistently because of you know all the gaps in the execution part got it don’t how do you remember how you found me betting yep I do so I was on Facebook and I saw a Facebook ad and you know one of the things that you said in there I made a lot of sense because just struck right to the heart of the problems I was having at the moment which was you know most people who are in this business you know consultants or whatnot I wasn’t even thinking of myself as a consultant but that’s what you called it and I was like okay that sounds kind of like me you said like they’re all generalists they’re trying to do too many different things for too many different people and because of that you know they can never get anything to work consistently and so that was just when you said that that really resonated with me and obviously you had this interesting accent and you know he stood out from everybody else that I was seen on Facebook at the time so you know I opted into your stuff and I watched your videos and it just made a lot of sense and so at that point I was like all right this guy knows something I don’t and I want to learn it and so at that point I don’t remember what you were charging for your thing I think it was maybe $1500 or maybe was $2,000 but I remember you had an option where you get some calls with you I think was two calls back when you did that and I took the upgraded package because I was like you know if I get stuck I want to be able to ask Sam a question and so yeah that was that was kind of how I found you and then I jumped in and it was it was really good stuff it’s awesome so Facebook Ads working back in 2014 and I mean like back then I was still in New Zealand so like I was in New Zealand in New Zealand had no idea I was going to move to America but I remember I was still targeting America that’s the beauty of the internet so and my wife was like this guy’s in New Zealand how do you know there’s not like some scammer you know and all this stuff I was like well it just seems like it would be a really elaborate scam like you know to me anytime people say that you know scam is a potential thing I just say look if people are really trying to scam people you know there’s so many other things they can do like the you know the Nigerian email scams like pulling like billions of dollars a year from people that are unsuspecting all over the world you know are there’s people that take advantage of the elderly with their retirement stuff so there’s so many other ways to make money if you really want to be a scammer so why would you why would you build a legitimate business around being a scammer so that was just always my rationale for that and you know your stuff made sense I was like he makes a lot of sense for for what he was saying he had to know what I’ve been going through to be able to connect those two things hmm and so then you joined and what happened after that so what happened after that is I think back in that time you were talking about the main shift you were mentioning was you know don’t just sell websites as a website sell it as like a marketing piece right like you know build a website and then build the website to sell and that it’s basically a conversion funnel process where you’re turning the website into a funnel that will direct people towards taking action with that customer since they get a lot of traffic to it and so repositioning is that you know I went from selling websites for you know 750 bucks or a thousand bucks or 1500 bucks to 5,000 and really really diving you know positioning those websites to be much more beneficial on that so from there I kind of started getting to a point where I would say at that time I immediately doubled I was kind of doing around five five six thousand a month and I was starting to get some consistency in in the work I mean there was still a lot of problems but I was making more money at that time than when I was making previously nice and then what happened from then so from there you started talking more about the marketing retainers and I had tried doing retainers previously and one of the many things I had done and it just seemed that so many people were charging $500 a month for this thing and so I was just looking at the math and I said you know I can’t hardly find anybody that’s any good that I can subcontract this to and on top of that you know they’re gonna want more than just $200 a month and so it just seemed to me like it was gonna be a really really long track to really build a a digital agency with that recurring revenue and then you kind of started talking about how some people were able to sell them for more and I was like oh really that thing that I’d you know written off and couldn’t sell for more than five hundred bucks and it was just about repositioning and finding the right clients that could afford larger retainers you know they could spend thousands of dollars a month and you could include other things like landing pages and you know start to get a little bit more niche focus so that’s kind of what led me up through I think that summer of 15 before you had your next product that you put out I was starting to look at doing more retainer stuff like that and I was getting some traction there with different clients and different niches saw that and what happened after that after that I think you came out with your your mastermind your first launch into that and I remember it was the most expensive thing I’d never bought something that much know up to this point I’d spent probably 20,000 or more on different things you know but all sorts of different programs trying to make stuff work and so you put out your program and it was it was very expensive relative to everything else I had done but I kind of knew that I was like stuck at this plateau and I really needed to make an investment to really push myself through the next level so around that period you came out with the event and I really only had enough money to pay for the initial down on it and maybe a month or two but I was like I have to make this work to continue to participate in this so you know I took the plunge I went for it and then went out to your event that you had want to say that was in San Diego maybe and that was I think it was in August of 2015 it’s around then you started talking more about you know to be upgrade from direct outreach to using Facebook Ads more consistently for your own clients and so you covered that at the event and then we basically implemented kind of niche down on a target market we were going to help with advertising started advertising to them on Facebook started getting some inbound strategy sessions from that and then really started you know working on growing the recurring revenue business so we’re on that period I went for maybe four to five thousand dollars a month by that December I was at about twenty thousand dollars a month and then through the spring I kind of plowed through to I think I got to about forty thousand dollars a month with retainers and kind of kept growing it from that point so got it so you went through the typical kind of path the evolution of a consultant you started out generalists done for you then you went to kind of nip specific done for you still doing the same thing but you were just doing it for a niche and at a higher price and then you wind a little bit more specific done few which was like the agency and then you went from using like organic to using paid methods and funnels and automation things like that that got you up to like twenty then it got you up to about 40 grand a month and then so that that path makes total sense and I think a lot of people see that but there was the the big turning point in terms of scale for you I remember was when you transitioned from done view and agency stuff to selling a program yeah so for me you know one of the things that I developed throughout the that period there from that I would say fall of 14 action a fall of 15 up through spring of of 16 was really a really effective LinkedIn method for targeting my market because they were a little bit they weren’t quite as as you know large there wasn’t quite as many of them and so that helped me develop a process that you know really was working quite well inside the LinkedIn side of things and so when I was looking at making a transition into kind of a program or you know consulting thing or done with you solution I was trying to look at what I had that was really effective that I could pass on to the people that they could implement and so my first kind of failure to launch into high ticket was taking a lot of the strategies that I had developed a lot of paid strategies we developed and trying to teach those to kind of business owners kind of going kind of a done with you solution for small businesses and what I really realized doing that was you know a lot of business owners their biggest challenges they just don’t have the time they really don’t the ones that have their stuff together and so it was really difficult to get them to implement any sort of a paid strategy for themselves and you know I kind of underestimated the learning curve of teaching someone you know Google Adwords or Facebook Ads who was in the service business and so that kind of didn’t really go anywhere you know I was having trouble getting any traction so that’s when I really looked at what I had and section my wife was this time he she said you know the one thing that you’ve done is that throughout this entire period you know a lot of other people that kind of watched me make that transition they were kind of asking me hey what did you do what differently or what were you doing and the one thing I had that I wasn’t really you know seen as it’s very valuable was the LinkedIn thing I thought it was fairly simple but you know there’s more than one person I kind of just showed that to and their businesses kind of took off so I started to see this pattern where I was like okay here’s this thing that I don’t think is that valuable or unique but a lot of people saw and they were like wow this this makes so much sense they did it and they got results so I kind of saw a hot there’s a little proof of concept right here that I could actually teach this and help people implement it so to me what I saw then is my program is you know working with people that are kind of in that startup phase of a digital agency helping the select a niche that’s not you know really really perilous because one of things I found is that there’s a number of niches in the digital marketing side that just are really a dead end for somebody unless they have a lot of very specific advantages so I was able to help people steer clear of niches that would kind of end up being dead-end and then give them a lead generation process they could do that wasn’t extraordinarily expensive to get going and get some traction they could then use to pivot to paid ads through LinkedIn and then also teaching them you’re really helping them implement high ticket selling and you know how to sell over the phone for marketing retainers because that in itself was its own kind of separate thing from selling over the phone for like programs right there was like some distinguishment s– there and so that was really what became the program I had was was teaching kind of startup agencies guys doing less than 10k a month and helping them kind of break the 10k barrier and grow up from there so it’s actually a couple people I’ve worked with that have gone into seven figures since I work with them and then there’s a lot of people that have hit ten ten thousand a month working with me on that nice yeah that’s interesting it’s I found the same thing too you can’t just teach people ads because ads cost money and they’re pretty complicated they absolutely work but it takes time and it cost money and a lot of people don’t have both of those you know but they can’t wait time and they can’t just be in money especially both at the same time so you need to cover the interim you know and that’s why having powerful organic methods is crucial because if you can get something working near then that can cashflow that and that works in the short term that works in the long they appear to give they’re like perfectly yep and I would agree I mean my mind I tell people look you got to come to table with at least one of those two things if you don’t have money you know you’re gonna need to have time you know you can’t come with neither those things because we’ve got nothing to work with at that point you know one if someone doesn’t have money all the time I mean what we’re we were they putting their time you know because usually someone doesn’t have money because they’re not working like that hard and they’ve got free time and usually you know that someone either has one or the other or they’re just wasting and being stupid so that’s a good it’s a good method but let’s talk about why like why you wanted to switch from the agency model we were making like 40 grand a month to the training model the programs because I know there’s a lot of people that that wonder why you know why did I move from you know cuz I used to have an agency why did I make the transition to programs and then why did Andrew argue to it why did you do it why does everyone seem to make that switch so I want to hear specifically in your case why you wanted to yeah it’s a good question and you know I look back at it I don’t honestly have a really great answer for that you know there’s a few different reasons you know one which I’ll just be transparent you I saw a lot of other people doing it so I thought okay well you know if other people are doing it maybe I can give it a shot you know the the coaching model does have a lot of advantages and that you can leverage your time more effectively and you can rely less on other people and so that was really for me it was okay there was either two steps like I had to become really really good at managing people and systems or I had to find a way for me to go farther I had to leverage myself more and so the reason I went that way was that there was a way where I could leverage some of the things that I’ve learned and leverage my own skills you know quite farther than that I mean at a certain point when I had my first $200,000 a month it was just me I mean I didn’t have anybody like now I’ve got an office I’ve got like four full-time staff I’ve got salespeople on top we’ve got a lot of contractors like we’ve grown tremendously since then and ironically it’s come full circle and that the next you know the thing that you think you need to grow that you skip you always have to come back and eventually hit that so you do have to learn the people and the system’s thing and so we’ve made a lot of strides in that in the last I would say six to twelve months but the reason I switch was because it was in a word leverage I was able to leverage what we did what we had developed and then from that you know I’ll get into later on the call some of the the things that I learned in hindsight from that you know like I think one of the there’s pros and cons to it so in the digital marketing space like there’s you know there’s some churn right you don’t keep clients forever you have to rely on other people to make sure that service gets delivered properly and so there’s not a lot of people that have built solutions around that where you know the service delivery piece can be really handled and that if you focus very niche specific and you have the best service in that niche there’s a massive opportunity there and so I’ll talk about later in the interview kind of where our latest pivots have gone down to is from looking back at the past mistakes and the weakness is what I did and then seen opportunities there too because anytime you see a big problem and you solve it there’s usually a lot of money on the other side of it because a lot of people ignore that they just go oh I’m not going to solve that all I’ll solve some other little quick thing here that doesn’t really last as long but all the the lasting money’s on the other side of solving really really big problems yeah I agree and one thing about the moving from the agency model to the to the program model is you know there’s nothing wrong with the agency but once you’ve been making like like 40 grand a month for most people man that’s like a dream there’s like that base a lot of people would still probably believe that it’s not even possible if only I could get there I mean and it’s it’s awesome but once you do anything for like six months you’re bored of it you want more you want to grow and when you look at the mechanics of it you’re like well I’ve got all of these humans I’ve got all of these channels of conversations going within all of these different places I’ve got you’ve got a lot of complexity with an agency business even at 40 grand a month you’ve got to manage a lot of stuff and when you think about scaling you’re like do I really want to just get more humans more complexity and the program model is a way to get that extra scale without adding that so it makes total sense when you get to that point but before that there’s nothing wrong with that model I mean you can you’ll you’ll feel the desire I’m just saying this for people at watching like you’ll feel the desire to to change to programs once you’ve kind of maxed out the agency model but until then it’s it’s an awesome model that I definitely recommend Solis yeah I think one of the mistakes I see too is that I think some people they get a couple clients and then they jump immediately you know I think a lot of people look at that and they don’t realize there was a period of time you know six to twelve months of course before that you know I did this for years I just didn’t do it very successfully because a lot of the scale things weren’t built in that I needed but you know a lot of people look and they think that I did it for you know a couple months and then I started teaching so like the thing that drives me nuts are guys that are like hey how to get your first client it’s a month after they got their first client you know it’s like you’re not really helping anybody at that point you really need to hone your skills because the only thing you know how to teach is how everything goes when it goes right and the big thing I learned over the years was all the different ways that it won’t work right and that was really what gave I think so my the stuff that I taught a lot more depth because I had a lot of context around dead ends that other people could avoid by failing so many times over and over again that’s really what you try to do is you know an expert or a mentor is shorten the odds of failure for people and one of the best ways is you know up and not repeat your own mistakes yeah I agree I like to look at that stuff too because my experience pretty much everything I do goes wrong like or not to plan and it’s only a it’s only of my newphew things that go to plan and when that happens I’m like wow like it’s like it barely ever happens so you’ve got to get really good and the program has to have contingencies for all of the wrong that can go wrong which is most of the time and it’s it’s infinite and yeah it’s got to be able to catch those things and bring them back I think the week programs expect it all to go right which it doesn’t and then we and it does go wrong they have no contingencies to pull it back and so everyone just jumps ship and then the ship sinks that couldn’t decide it better myself that’s exactly the problem with programs is that they’re not built around all the failure and all the different contingencies of to do when it doesn’t go according to plan because that’s that’s pretty much life right there it’s interesting because I work with a forensic psychiatrist who’s who like trains pro athletes like he trains like the Arsenal football team and like he’s like like really good and he said the one thing that really pro athletes have in common is that they only want they all they obsess about what could go wrong so the reason why they work with them is like what like when something goes wrong in a match and all the pressures on they don’t want to break down there they want to they want to like thrive there because when things are good it’s easy but it’s it’s all about like real competitors and really like people who dominate it what they do they perform when everyone else folds so it’s quite interesting they all look to the dark side to to master that well and that’s true and programs too this is a really interesting point so now let’s talk about like we know why you moved to the programs and let’s talk about your program like who it was for like what the niche was and then what problem you were solving for them and you know what your offer and pitch was to them so that people can understand the mechanics of that yeah so my offer was effectively you know look at you and newer agency you’re the funny thing too is that when I first launched I wasn’t appealing to new agencies at all I was just trying to sell to establish once a lot of the established ones they almost dismissed my solutions as like to like even though I was been making more money than them if they were already at like 10k a month they almost looked at me like hey you know what it can’t be that easy or that solution won’t work and so I had a really hard time selling to those people and then I found no kind of my first sales to people that didn’t have clients I disqualified those people I said if you didn’t have any clients didn’t want to work with you and I had like multiple people keep begging me they’re like please you know show me your thing just give me a shot and so finally I sold a guy and you know he went out and he implemented what I showed him and I think he got like two or three clients in like four weeks you know and he was all the way up to like six thousand dollars a month and I was just like man you know you know it took me years to get from zero to that amount and this guy did it just a few months or so my help and so the program after that became you know basically I helped kind of anyone doing less than 10k month in digital marketing you know niche down developed a kind of a predictable lead generation processor LinkedIn and then sell effectively over the phone how to position your offers and navigate all the selling and the closing of deals and so that was kind of what it was for we do it over eight weeks and we’d include some support for that period of time and then you know as a combination of like a digital thing with some call coaching calls and stuff where we would go talk to each other up you know a couple times a week I’d review some of their materials and give them pointers on things and so I think we were selling that we started selling it at 4,000 then we looked to five and then we went up to six you know with that program and then after got better than that I think we want him to eight and that was kind of round where it stayed before pivoted to the the newer thing we’ve been doing more recently and what was the main problem that you were solving for these people like what explain what their situation would be like when they’re when they need what you were selling got it yeah so that would be they were really struggling to narrow down a niche right in digital marketing like they just they didn’t know they didn’t know enough about the digital marketing niches to really know which one to choose they didn’t or if they had a niche you know they’re really really struggling to get any appointments consistently right like they maybe they had their niche down but they couldn’t they didn’t have a huge budget for ads and they really needed to nail when their messaging and everything that’s where LinkedIn solution did it and then the more rare solution was I had people that you know had their niche they were getting calls and they weren’t closing them and they might help to do that and so you know most people I was helping solve all three problems but then some people in they came to me with one or two of those problems and so it’s kind of like a three-digit combination there’s really the niche the leads and the sales and just solving you know whichever stage they were thought they were stuck at helping them get through the rest of them yeah that’s interesting so they they basically knew that they wanted to be doing digital marketing and they already had a couple of clients and they knew that they could do the work and deliver and they had the expert they had this I would so called the specialized information and and the specialized knowledge sorry and they knew what to do when they were skilled at the craft but what they were totally missing was the side the business side of how to attract clients which is you know you need to know who the target market is then you need a system to get leads and then you need a system to close them which is like 50% of the business you know and that’s what I know to like all businesses all experts out there like lawyers and accountants they know how to do law and they know how to do accounting all the agencies they know how to do digital marketing but they don’t know the other side and it sounds like that’s what you nailed for them and you taught it in a program you’ve seen how much it was now let’s talk about how you were because now we understand who it’s for and what it was but let’s talk about how you were able to sell this thing like from end to end like how did you do the targeting how did you generate the leads how did you sell it in to end sure so we started by running Facebook Ads so for me I did like a video sales that are funnel so and I just wrote up like hey I got a write up some copy to describe their problems you know draw them and then with there’s some good copy write up the the problems their experience showing that you know when someone sees that ad and they’re my ideal customer they’re gonna say oh that’s me and they pay attention so he ran ads those then went to you know a landing page that you know kind of spoke to that promise a little bit and then from there it went to like a video like a little video sales letter and so I made a video sales letter that was I think my first one was maybe 15 minutes long and so they’d watched that video I think we call like a value video now you know it just it talked about their problems and that you know most of them are struggling to get clients and all that stuff and then after that you know offer them to fill out a survey which actually fill out the survey they they’d get on a call through schedule once then I get on the call you know we’d if they look like they were fed if they didn’t look like they were fit you know I’d just tell them hey it doesn’t look like a fit and we wouldn’t even have the call we’d get on the phone and you know we just diagnose you know what’s what’s the problem you know why are we talking what’s not working what are your goals why haven’t you reached them all that kind of stuff and then you know if it seemed like a fit presented the offer to the person and you know if they went for it then we started working together and so then from there they get into our we had a little Facebook group we had our program was I think we’re we’re using kajabi still use that and they get into that and then they get on a couple calls a week and I kind of laid out the program is like eight weeks like here’s the different steps you do for the program that go through that they’d have assignments after each one they submit that you know I’d kind of give him feedback on it and yeah I mean that was that was kind of the whole thing and to end it’s interesting and this is how I see it happen all the time it’s like early on in 2014 you kind of had an agency and you didn’t know how to get NIT specific and get clients and then you learned that and then it worked for you but then you mastered it and then it really worked for you and only when you had mastered it to the point where it was like I’m pretty like totally impressive and valuable for most other agency owners then you flipped around instead of just doing it for you then you started teaching it to other people which is like the exact way it always happens you know like once you master something like to the point that you’re above the rest of everyone else then their pocket of opportunity opens up for you not only to execute it for yourself but for you to teach it to other people and it sounds like that’s exactly what happened there so now let’s talk about how you went to you know two hundred and fifty grand a month because at the point you made the switch right from the a see to selling the program we walk we’re making about 40 grand a month yeah I was doing about 40 grand a month before I’d switch to programs cool and then how did the first few months go after switching to programs well that’s where I had the failure that I told you about with trying to sell the kind of done with you marketing stuff for service businesses and that didn’t really go anywhere and so then in May of that year May or June was when we made our switch and we started started promoting that and one of the the subtle things that really made an impact for us is I felt that I was kind of stuck in a little bit of a feedback loop with where I was in my life because like the place we were living and everything was kind of stuck in this you know making less than $10,000 a month world and so there was a lot of stuff tied to the way I was before you know like the environment I had and your one of the things that you had done that you know at the time I didn’t understand but in hindsight made a lot of sense was that you changed your location you changed your environment and sometimes when you have a dramatic environment change it kind of shake loose a lot of things that are kind of holding you back that you know you maybe you can’t identify but you know they’re just they’re gone when you leave and so in June of I want to say 16 we were at an event you were talking about that experience and then you just said it and I just suddenly about in that moment was like I know what I have to do part of what I need to do to really broke you know break through the next level cuz I just launched the program and it was you know out of the gate was doing okay but I knew I need to change my environment and so we were living in Michigan at the time and so at that point I decided you know hey I think I want to we need to relocate and so my wife and I’d always talked about where we wanted to live and we wanted to raise our kids you know which were you know our two young girls at the time and you know Florida was always kind of you know that place we wanted to live and so we said hey let’s move to Florida so I called my wife and I was like hey we’re gonna move to Florida in a couple months and so by August 15th we’d sold her house and we had relocated to Florida and kind of in that period of time that was kind of like me leaving any safety net and anything that I’d known kind of behind and that’s kind of when you know the program started to get some subtraction and it was struggling a little bit because at that point I wasn’t I was focusing on the guys that already had clients and the bigger shift happened when I started to realize you know what a lot of the guys that didn’t have as many clients and maybe they had one client but we’re struggling had the most to gain and were you know in some cases the easier ones to work with because I’d give them a couple things and there was so much more for them to learn in a short period of time versus the guys that you know they’d almost were stubborn in some of their ways and they’d already developed some bad habits they didn’t really want to get out of they were just like too busy on keeping their current business so that’s really what helped was that I started getting results I did a lot of organic stuff too you know as people would follow me I just talked about results that I was getting with people and that would draw a lot more people in so that was kind of what what led up to that next growth spurt was and just kind of consistently building that up and then you know training the sales team training people to sell and then working on kind of scaling the business which I started doing and I would say April of last year it’s kind of when I really started working on building the team that’s kind of written I want to zoom in on a spot here because there’s a few things you mentioned the first one is you know you you changed your environment which I know that there makes a big difference because it’s when I made the biggest difference in my entire life and then when Andrew argue did it it made like the next big difference for him and then I think oh it’s I can pretty much remember the event was that the one we were in Miami we were in Miami up yeah and I remember you saying yeah you were thinking about about doing that and then you did it and then this is a really I just want to I just want to highlight this because this is a really powerful hack for anybody that that is trying to you know to get to that next level up it’s like at a certain stage you don’t do it in the beginning when you’re broke and it would it’s impossible and it’s would be totally irresponsible to go and get a nice place and totally move right so if you want to do this move at a time when you’ve got money and it’s a stretch but it’s not like going to completely wipe you out and be totally irresponsible and you want to move into a place that is you know it’s better it’s a better it’s a better it’s a better like place within a better location and you know you’re surrounded by nicer things and everything like that so that your confidence kind of goes up and matches with that place and a lot of the time it’s best if you actually change cities or states or things like that because then you leave behind all of those other behavior patterns and you move from Michigan to Florida and you’ve got a nicer house I know that because you used to work in your basement in Michigan didn’t you yeah that called cold drafty basement yeah I remember you saying you would like it had no windows you’re down in this basement and you would wear like pajamas down there and it doesn’t matter how it doesn’t matter how good you are at what you do like if you’re in a basement in pajamas with no windows there’s always gonna be there feeling it in the back of your mind like that you’re not successful you know what I mean even if things ah I mean because it just doesn’t feel that successful you know and it makes it a huge difference so people who are listening if you’re at that point you’re at like 40 grand a month right and I know at the point where and removed he was probably doing about the same – like we nearly won get like what if you get to 18 grand a month and you’re still living at home or something you want to get out of there and get like a better place but when you’re at 40 grand a month you want to get an even nicer place someplace that you know it’s quite impressive for you because it makes a huge difference and when you did that move like what what happened pretty much immediately after that because let’s talk about before you hide the salespeople because you got to what 200 grand a month just selling this program by yourself before you hide anyone yep so what made that happen and how quickly did that happen so we got to 200 grand a month by that fall want to say November November December was when we hit that and I would say you know the environment had a lot to do with it you know the stuff I was teaching was working there’s a lot of people getting results there’s a lot of momentum and a lot of people sharing that and so you know that that really helps so really it was I can’t point to anything specifically than the environment change made a big difference you know I was really focused on what I was doing and you know we really got to a good a good rhythm there before we got to that point and when you were at like 200 grand a month by yourself let’s explain what was making that happen like how much did you have to spend on ads and then how much were you getting like a strategy session for on average or an application and then like how many calls were you doing per day and what was your closing ratio like just so people can understand kind of what what variables have to be existing data data to hit that level yeah that’s a great question so let me do some math here so I was doing I think I’d sold about thirty of them and I just started launching my mastermind at the time so 30 times 6000 yeah so I mean basically was a sale a day but you know per week I would say I was closing 20% so you know that’s a hundred and I mean it’s a good about forty calls a week is what I was doing so you know 40 calls a week I mean that was about eight calls a day I mean it was it was a full-time job just taking sales calls yeah I’m just gonna do the mentors too because people the math makes it so much clearer so if you were making two hundred thousand a month / your program was like six grand a year to do 33 sales a month which would be one a day if you’re working every day of the week including Saturday Sunday and then we divide that into well then we times that by if you’re closing it 20 percent we times that by five so that’s you’d have to do a hundred and sixty six lists that call that a hundred and seventy strategy sessions a month and then how many days a week we were working back then I mean I was working every day but you know I would say mainly Monday through Friday and then Saturday Sunday I do like I’d work on other stuff like I work on my ads work on my program things like that but yeah I mean I wasn’t working forty hours a week that’s 200 let’s call it like six days a week so then we’ve got to do that so that’s 24 so 170 divided by 24 there’s seven strategy sessions a day yeah so that people who are listening that that the number right there that’s what makes this happen it’s like if you’re sitting there in your room and you’re like man why aren’t I making seven figures didn’t look at any author you’re like man why aren’t I making six figures I don’t feel like oh man why don’t I ever client well look at your bloody strategy sessions how many have you done I see some people and they they say it things aren’t working and then I ask them how many strategy sessions they’ve done and they say they’ve done two in the last three months well Josh was doing seven a day every day six days a week and that’s what makes this happen and it like I always tell people the one what’s the one thing that you can zoom in on and look at to like determine how much money someone’s making strategy sessions and so this is cool to break it down like that it makes it a lot simpler and that’s a lot of work man that’s like what were your hours like 10 like what time did you wake up what time did you go to sleep so the last few years I pre religiously go to bed at like 10 and I get up at like so he was get like a good good night’s sleep I can’t really function without it so yeah I mean I pretty much got up and I mean I was at work by and sometimes I’d work toll eight right where I’d be back at six you know come back for dinner no but I had a lot of days working about to a.m.

To p.m. yeah there’s a lot a lot of our teen hours today like six seven days a week just even 60 70 hour weeks which makes scene Saturday Saturday or Sunday would be kind of like a half day like Sunday or Saturday we’d like do some sort of family thing get out and do something you know stuff like that that make sense because if you’re working 10 hours a day and you’ve got seven strategy sessions that’s like seven hours of that 10 so your time distribution was 70/30 like 70% sales calls then probably 30% I’m guessing working on your ads to generate those calls sending emails doing organic things and actually working on your program yep it’s a 70/30 for people who are listening to that that makes sense now let’s talk about how you were able to generate those because that’s a lot like to generate seven calls per day every day what was making that happen Facebook Ads when we were spending about 30 grand a month so about a thousand bucks a day so that makes sense so that was dredging sessions are around around 200 bucks but you know we got organic ones too so that’s kind of where you look at 25 to 30 a month and they make scenes because if you’ll get in seven strategy sessions a day spending a grand today there’s a hundred and forty three dollars per strategy session which makes that make sense and well you said you were probably paying closer to like what 200 but you probably had canceled you probably can’t sling a bunch of the applications which makes sense that’s how that’s the difference there because to have 74 people listening to do seven strategy sessions a day you really need to generate at least ten applications because there’s going to be 30% of them that aren’t a good fit that you want to cancel and you want to make sure that your day is full of the cream of the crop you know and you so you need to generate more than what you actually need by a margin of at least 20 to 30% that’s what would make that cost go up a little bit more and then you were getting them do you’re taking them you’re running Facebook heads taking them through your funnel doing strategy sessions closing them working on the program that all make sense and then you were at that point you got to you know 200 grand a month and then what did it what did it feel like getting to that level you know it felt pretty good you know at first and then you know just like with everything you get a little bit bored and you’re like all right so you’ve you know you can kind of cruise here and that was kind of where I made that decision there was a lot of guys I saw out there that were they like to hover there and stay a one-man business and I said you know to get to the next level I basically have to build a team you know and so to me that was the next challenge that I was you know after a few months of that I was like all right the next mountain is I have to I have to build a business that doesn’t rely 100% on me because at that moment it really did if I want to take a vacation for a week you know I had to get off the phone you know and not take calls and so that was kind of the first place I looked was you know I needed to need to get sales going you know get somebody else that can sell and this is an interesting one because you know what by most people if they’re making 200 grand a month by themselves that’d be stoked I mean they’d be happy back at 40 grand a month so what is it that makes you want to want more and want to go to the next level yeah I mean that’s a good question you know it’s one that sometimes I don’t know the exact answer for even myself right now for me I’ve always had a vision of making a giant splash you know to me money is like a it’s it’s a thing but you know I think the people that just chased the money they end up not really getting much of it it’s really about chasing the impact and the result and so for me I’ve always been results oriented where you know the money is a side effect of of how well you’re you’re performing in the business world you know because that’s the money’s always gonna flow to the results and the people that are are getting traction and so to me it was like you know one I didn’t want to have a business that relied solely on me to actually function so it was partly unassessed I really felt that I need to do that and then of course obviously the the flip side of that coin of not having the business rely on you is that you can grow it to be much larger because it’s not you know you can build off of other people’s efforts and momentum and create an environment where you know they’re happy and you’re happy and the whole business is growing so it’s just kind of like naturally the next challenge I think a lot of people that become entrepreneurs are naturally competitive I’m sure you compare it consider yourself competitive I’m competitive and that’s like that core thing and so the nature of competition is always wanting to to level up and unlike a game where you know you can win the NBA Finals you know and become champion there even the guys that win that the only thing they’re looking to do is do that again the next year there’s always that you know how can I push the envelope and so for me that’s it’s no different you know it’s it’s it’s a competitive nature is I want to go out there I want to make an impact I want to help other people with their businesses and if I help them I know that helps that helps me at the same time but that’s what’s that’s what’s required to really grow is to do that and so I wanted to be able to do that and build a team of people I could do that with me your business is funny because it’s like you get to crush other people but you get to crush your competition by helping the world so it’s like you get to you get to like crush people by helping a lot of people it’s like quite a weird scenario you know what I mean because you you’ve got to help your market and you’ve got to help them better than anyone else but if you’re helping your market better than your competitors then that in turn crushes them which is it’s quite funny when I think about it sometimes and let’s talk about now like the lifestyle changes you’re able to make because I often skip over all of the stuff like I asked you how you felt I never asked questions like that but I know people want to know things like that but what changes to a lifestyle we were able to make because I know you remember you bought a bidder you’ve got a bit of house and then you’ve got a Tesla like to explain that stuff yeah I mean so like I I think that there’s and I’m probably stealing this from somebody but there’s like three different phases people go through you know the first phase is like you know you don’t really have any money you may be average middle class or lower class and you’re looking at other people that are successful and you’re like initially driven by that you’re like I want to be successful I want to get all those things and said you become success when you can buy those things then you get those things you’re like hey now I’ve got all those things so now it’s like this weird you know mirror moment where suddenly you’re the guy with all those things and everybody else is looking at you like oh I want to be that guy and that’s kind of a weird thing to do like to go from like looking at the people that are successful then being that successful guy and so yeah when we changed our environment we you know saved a lot of money we you know lead out anywhere we wanted you know I mean at this point it’s like monetarily there wasn’t like a you know within reason right I mean there’s you know Michael Jackson you know had 100 million dollars in debt or some obscene amount of things just goes so no matter how much money you make you can always spend it but relatively speaking you know the things that you know it would have avoided you know like I shopped at Aldi you know for for many years in the States here that’s like it’s like a really really budget grocery chain and the food there’s not bad you know I mean like you’re getting like basic you know ingredients and stuff like that I mean Aldi works but you know that’s what it takes like we had such a tight budget we lived off of a few thousand a month at times and so to not you know care about the brand of something you get and to not worry about you know being able to afford the tip for the people at you know the restaurant you know not going to too fancy for restaurants that you can always cover the tip you know to not worry about those types of things was like really really great coincidentally what happens is maybe this is on a year and a half or a two-year fuse but after you kind of go into the first the second phase where you have all that I noticed that you kind of did this a little bit yourself like you get to that phase where you start to look at these things that’s just like baggage that inhibits you playing the game at a higher level and so for me I’ve come down from that where now I look at you know the cars and a lot of these are the things I’m like you know they’re not really not helping me achieve my goals like they were nice but now it’s like I look at it I just say that’s money I could be putting towards this or I can be investing this in that and so it’s kind of interesting it’s like it goes almost full circle you go back to basically choosing to live a less extravagant life because you don’t really care and so if you notice like I’m wearing a t-shirt right you’re wearing a t-shirt it’s kind of ironic like this is probably like a ten dollar t-shirt and there’s a lot of guys that try to look successful they’re not that successful and you know the guys that are successful you sometimes wouldn’t even know it by looking at them right cuz they’re not they’re not wearing some really fancy stuff and so that was kind of that that third phase that kind of happened more in the last six months where I started looking at that just saying huh now this stuff isn’t really helping my bigger picture goal and so now I’ve kind of gone through process upon loading that and then investing and focusing more in the business and that’s helped the business a lot have you sold your Tesla about two oh you are gonna nice it’s a big move when someone gives up the car I remember I hate on cars like Ferraris and stuff and trait like it was it was like a hard thing to do you know because it’s like it’s the thing you’ve cherished but it does feed a bigger goal that’s way more meaningful than a Ferrari you know yeah yeah I mean that’s absolutely the case and my wife was even like are you sure you want to get rid of it and I was like yeah I feel like I’ve gone through that phase it’s just weird cuz I never would have guessed that like I would have thought I’ll be going for like the next upgrade the next upgrade and instead I’m like no I’m really focused on our goals yeah well I’ve seen the guys who keep getting the neatest upgrades they end up getting wiped out like there’s no good Eames to just continuously upgrading your lifestyle you know like in MIDI ends up taking you it’s like a and then you’ve got to keep things simple to you know to grow there has to be a symmetry between the growth and your income and you know the the lifestyle expense you have if you most people keep expanding their lifestyle at the same rate that they keep expanding their income so they’re never actually making any progress and keeping it like you look at Warren Buffett and stuff they fix it still got the same house still got the same car but his income is growing that’s how he’s growing to be where he is he doesn’t keep growing it so that’s an interesting point and one thing I want to put in here is that you did all of this you know when you were doing working ten hours a day six days a week and doing seven strategy sessions a day you have a family – mm-hmm so that’s an important point because I’m sure a lot of people listening alike ah but Josh could do that because he you know he’s he’s probably single or he’s probably just married doesn’t have any kids but you you do so explain how you were able to work that much and have that much focus and put in that much work when you had a young family yeah so my daughters are five and six now so we move they were probably you know three and four and so they’re very young you know but for me there’s no easy way to put it I mean we had to make a choice you know I said look you know we can do the whole you know dad’s around and for every moment and everything but you know this business isn’t gonna grow and so you know my wife and I we just had a lot of discussions we talked about it and talked about it and we kind of made a decision where we said you know were for us having the freedom of movement you know having the the lifestyle choices knowing that you know we’re financially secure no matter what that was more important than it was worth going for that initially if it meant that that we could hit that and so you know I was only the last six months you know six to twelve months that I really started to have more time you know kind of when I started building the team in spring of 17 that was able to start to have that time but I just said look this is going to be a season of our lives you know they’re young now I mean they’ll remember some of it you know but you know to me it was it was definitely not easy right you know it’s it’s tough to go through that but you know now having more time to spend with them being able to have complete flexibility on my schedule if I want to and all that stuff you know a lot of people will never get that and that doesn’t rarely just shows up you know it does take a push it does take the effort there you know and so for me the important part was making sure my wife was on board and you know we were a hundred percent you know down to do that and you know it worked out you know but it was it was definitely tough there was a lot of sacrifices you know a lot of a lot of time we could have spent that you know I focused on the business but you know I look at that and I say you know for where we are you know it worked out but I know that that’s definitely not an easy thing got it and then we’ve covered to a story pretty much from the very beginning all the way up to the point two hundred and fifty grand a month selling this program now let’s talk about some of the you know the recent things you’ve been doing because I know you’ve been looking at at doing some more innovative things recently so talk to us about that yeah so there’s there’s the last two things I would say they’ll talk about is the innovation stuff and then also the team-building stucks I think that’s an important turning point is in early seventeen you know I kind of started realizing all right like I’ve taken this as far as I can go there’s only so many hours I can work in the day you know I wanted to spend some more time with my family and have that flexibility and not just be like hey if I don’t have any strategy calls for myself today we don’t make money today and so your that is one of the limitations of the high ticket business is that when you have recurring revenue you can kind of count on getting paid every month but if you don’t have recurring revenue you know if you take a month off of high ticket like that’s you know you don’t get paid anything that month accept any rebuilds from what you sold previously so that was like that it kind of felt a bit like a hamster wheel because it was like all on me I was running the ads I was doing the coaching I was doing everything myself and so in some ways you know this is not to put a knock on it was really just a very very highly paid self-employed person right I didn’t really have a business you know meaning to me the definition of a business I’ve heard this before is you know you can take a two-week vacation and it’s not like your revenue plummets and the other one is you can buy a customer so I had the first one I could buy customers but I couldn’t take a vacation most people can’t do either they can’t buy a customer they can’t take a vacation in their business so that’s when the first thing I looked at I said okay the easiest thing or the biggest chunk was the sales so I started an individual who I knew this person and I kind of trusted them and so I thought okay this is someone I trust who is very moldable very pliable and that just turned out not to to work out because the person just didn’t have the raw talent to really make it work and so for me the lesson I learned was that the most important thing the person needs is that they must have the raw talent right the salespeople the talent is like a characteristic like they they good with rejection or a skill like they know how to close it’s hard to perfectly describe because we’re still working on like I can kind of spot it more easily now but at the time it was basically I can’t describe it anything else than just like a killer instinct you know and not that they’re gonna kill somebody you know but just like they have that they just they have that people smart they can just pick up on nuance you know cuz selling over the phone is very it’s very nuanced because you’re not sitting across from somebody you know the vast majority of human communication is nonverbal you know a lot of body language stuff so you have no body language on the phone all you have are the words more importantly the tonality the pacing the words all those different things and so if you can’t pick up on the subtle hidden meanings of what someone’s saying versus what they’re actually saying you won’t close no and that was something that I learned a hyper-awareness right yes right and so understanding what someone really means when they say something listening for that slight you know hint in their tone to know where to dig into something or when someone’s actually told you what’s really going on you don’t know that you can’t pick up on that you’re not you’re just not gonna make it and so that’s almost something that I couldn’t really figure out how to teach I just had it innately and the only thing that happened to me was mine became much sharper just after doing thousands of calls and so one of my students had that she was selling very well but she didn’t really enjoy was the fulfillment process and so I approached I said hey you know I know you’re you’re struggling with this business because you don’t like doing the work after you sell it so would you consider selling for me and she said yes and so you know immediately you know she just she had the raw skill and had the motivation and so it was very easy to teach her train her and develop her and she really crushed it I mean she was selling 20 units a month for us at one point just herself which you know is pretty impressive and so after that by the time the fall came around we started developing a few other salespeople and everything and so at a certain point we had three people selling and so we kind of built up and established our team and so not having to sell on the calls myself gave me a lot more time to focus on other things like the program focus on the ads and so you want the other things we did was we then started hiring people to run our ads and so to me those are kind of two pieces is getting the ads and the sales team and those things can really stabilize then you can really start to focus on the product and innovation and so that kind of leads into the second phase of what we’re doing more recently and so to me the biggest challenge that I found and the whole digital marketing industry has this that’s kind of ironic because it’s not what you would think is it’s just not very good at digital marketing and there’s a lot of people that can do digital marketing but they can’t really get really good results for people and so I spent a lot of time thinking about that because I had students that were successful in that they sold people they got a great niche they sold people and they had clients and they would lose the clients I would just be like well why don’t you lose the client and it was always well the results weren’t there I never really focused on that much because to me I just assume like you know people you know once you get the client people can get the results and that just kind of kept coming up is this this ongoing problem is that the results people weren’t getting good enough results and there was a few reasons I mean one of them was they wouldn’t be niche focused but even then the niche focus ones the process didn’t cover the whole spectrum of end to end right so when you think about us it’s like teaching imagine teaching someone how to generate strategy sessions with Facebook and then not teaching them how to sell it right and that’s more or less the best way to describe the problem a lot of people had is that they would send leads to companies and companies would be missing a few of the pieces to actually ROI those leads and if they couldn’t ROI the leads it wouldn’t matter whose fault it was you wouldn’t keep the client so the farther up the ladder you go and learning to solve the problem you know the more money there is and so to me this is kind of what led us to our an iteration where we said okay the problem is you know people know how to market it they didn’t win this they know how to market they know how to sell and do the lead generation but then after they get the client we need to develop a done-for-you process that does that so our program kind of shifted to now what it has is we basically have a white label contractor that we work in lockstep with and so they’re already running campaigns in niches all over the US and so they are able to know the baselines because if you get a client San Diego the results are totally different than in Kentucky because san diego’s are more expensive market and so you know someone would get like results in Kentucky and sell someone in San Diego and it would bomb and they can never figure out why and so these are all problems we started to put together and develop a solution and so the solution was really it’s almost like we got into the providing a proof-of-concept business as you would call it right it’s like a lot of people didn’t have the proof of concept they just wanted to sell and so we basically now sell a proof of concept around digital marketing where they come to us they sell in a niche we already have results in that niche and the results are replicatable meaning that we know exactly what the baselines are the the pluses and the minuses all over the US so they can go to you know one of our niches is mortgages then go to a mortgage broker in San Diego they can say hey right now we’re getting these results and we’re closing loans for you know a thousand dollars so if you pay us five thousand you should get five loans does that work out for you economically and you know most the time they’re like yeah because the national average for a mortgage is like two thousand dollars to acquire one so we basically now kind of develop this like fleet of niches where we have the contractors where agencies come and partner with us they get access to our contractors and all the data we built around what works in those markets so when they sell a client they can kind of hack our proof of concept and kind of jump to the front of the line so instead of starting at the bottom of the mountain they’re starting at the top and so that was kind of the big chain was that now we’re kind of building our business more around a recurring revenue model with our clients instead of just teaching them and then setting them off we’re saying look we’ll build with you and so if you get clients will basically be your back end and because we have so much data about what’s working and we leverage all sorts of proprietary data we can get better results in a lot of different really competitive niches and so that that attracts a lot of people to us who are trying to start their agency but they want to have a product that can actually compete or they’re already established and you know they’re getting soso results but they see that our results are actually better than theirs and they don’t want to not be selling the best in the marketplace so that’s kind of our most recent pivot is doing that and then you know only putting a certain number of people in each niche so that you know there’s not an endless amount of competition got it it makes sense because I know everybody’s first need in problem is getting a customer but once they get the customer it becomes delivering a service or a product that’s good enough so that the customer stays and repeat purchases so it seems like once you solved the first level because there’s like you know there once you’ve got in one problem another problem arises from solving the existing problem it’s like first second order first second third order like defects and so you have solved first and second order yeah and so that’s exactly that’s exactly where it led us was you know what’s the bigger problem upstream and so to me you know no one would want to tackle getting results in the digital marketing industry now they think out that’s a huge problem you know that’s there’s not even an easy solution and so we’re starting to carve out a really effective solution and I mean like some of the results are pretty crazy like you know a mortgage lead and just using Facebook a mortgage lead might cost you 15 to 20 bucks in San Diego which is like the most expensive real estate market and they make the most money there we’ve got guys using our data and stuff they’re getting them for like three dollars and seventy five cents right so if you can get leads that are the same quality or better for like you know 75% less than everybody else I mean that’s almost a license to print money it’s like you’ve almost you’re finding a pocket between that you can provide a lower acquisition cost and so that’s what we’ve kind of passed on to our customers they come with us they use our contractors they use our data they just effectively become the sales and the customer service and of course as I just told you I mean that’s the easy things to outsource is the sales and the customer service once it’s working so we built our business with our our clients that they’re making money and we’re making money with and the most recent thing we’ve were putting out is a new product I can’t go into a lot of details but it’s one that’ll be less niche specific that will basically just help people sell to their website visitors that haven’t bought from them that are interested and so it’s going to help identify who those people are and then allow them to market to these people you know do Direct Mail retargeting to reach out to people that have clearly expressed interest they’ve looked at a whole bunch of stuff on their website but they haven’t taken action with them and then allow them to you know reach out make an offer to those people because that’s where a lot of money is for a lot of different businesses yeah that’s like I can I can see that coming like it’s just around the corner within the whole internet it’s gonna get personalized where if you go you’re gonna see something different than what somebody else sees yep that’s exactly what’s behind what we’re building is you know basically the ability to identify who people are so that we can make the most relevant offer to that person whereas everything now is you have to build a landing page that appeals to the broadest audience of people right you can’t really have it personalized and so for us and this is Erin which sucks right hmm and even then you don’t know who the person is that’s visiting so with this it would know everything about you and so for us that’s what we’re building is an identity graph so that when someone comes to the website we know who you are and we know what you want to buy and if you’re looking to buy what we sell we can personalize that experience and then also know who’s gonna buy what you sell before they’ve even gone to somebody I mean so it’s kind of like predicting a Minority Report for crimes for for buyers you know to know hey this person’s gonna buy this because they’re starting a pattern that matches what everybody else has done on this established purchase so if everybody else that buys a mortgage does this research process and then we now know when that person starts it we can just mark it to that person instead of marketing to everybody and hoping that we kind of scraped through the margin the few people in that haystack you know that are actually looking to buy it’s funny there I heard remember reading the story that this woman was like she just started seeing ads about being pregnant like on Facebook and on on display ads and stuff and she’s like why am i seeing these I’m not pregnant and then she got a pregnancy test and she was good but how you feel was sick coronary had which is faster argot had this years ago they had their way of doing this with loyalty cards so when every time you purchase something right you swipe the loyalty cards all that behaviors attached to that person is individual and so as they go out and make purchases they can look at future purchases and look back and say okay these people bought PV cribs was there any patterns in the people that bought the baby crib before they bought it and they found things and so this this teenage girl got a personalized like advertisement mailed to their house for that and the dad went into the target he was furious he was like are you trying to get my daughter pregnant and then days later found out his daughter was pregnant it was because you know they would basically trigger personalized advertisements and so then and then after that a few years later target did an integration with Time magazine where Time magazine sent out personalized ads so everyone that got their edition of Time magazine had to personalize that from Target based on what they were looking to buy at that moment and so that’s basically what’s happening is that every single placement is going to become inventory for a centralized kind of data solution and so that’s kind of what we’re building is the ability to then know who’s going to buy and then push out advertisements on any channel that they’re on online or offline got it and now let’s talk about because because we’ve been on for just over an hour here so we’ll try and wrap it up now with two questions so the first one is what would you know in your whole experience of going through all of these different things like what would you say has been the one most transformational part mmm it’s a good question I think that there’s definitely I don’t know if this is the most transformational but definitely very impactful was was the move you know moving changing your environment really does help you I mean I’m almost like I could see how some people got to get addicted to that like I’m almost at a point where I want to do that again like I want to make another major environment change but I would say that’s that’s a big one once you hit a certain level of success you know to hit that next level is just push out of that and change your environment so I mean that would be one and I think the second most impactful thing was really just that constant search like that at heat-seeking desire to find something that works and to not feel like you have to reinvent everything I think a lot of people they they tried to go to unique like they’re like oh I’m gonna do some very bizarre unique thing that’s unproven and there’s a lot of rewards there if those things work but there’s a high chance of failure right and so for us you know I think you can focus on a high chance of failure stuff when you have a bunch of things that are already working like we make a lot of like Amazon does that’s like the moonshot bets well I think what was the the word he had for it if there’s a 10% chance or maybe see like a 1% chance of like a 10,000 times return on investment they take that because that’s what basically adds up some some formulation of that where they just basically play the odds but you didn’t do that the first day he built Amazon let me focus on the sure thing with people gonna buy books right so I think a lot of people they focus on the moonshot thing because then they they basically tell themselves if this works then XYZ and I think that the better thing is to focus on what’s already working you know leverage things that work and don’t try to create something from complete scratch because I don’t think there’s any it’s like they want to bake a cake that doesn’t have a single ingredient that’s ever been used before like no flour or sugar or anything well it’s like most good recipes are like 90% something else and it’s only like that 5 or 10% that’s something else that you kind of add to it or synthesize it differently so don’t try to create a totally different recipe just create a recipe that works that you can leverage don’t say those the two things a good point there just because you were talking about the Jeff Bezos thing and yeah you they take those massive bits which are risky but only because they can take a lot of them because most of them fail and he says that like 9 out of 10 of those bits we take wool fail but the one that does more than pays for all of the ones that don’t so yeah if you’re taking those moonshot bits you need to be able to take more than ten of that you need to take ten or more often because most of them going to fail and then you need to be able to cover those losses and those investments which is huge so until you build a platform first which can have the the people like the employees and and it can produce the capital to go into those things and survive that term then yeah I mean that’s like Jeff Bezos now he’s doing Blue Origin with the spaceships imagine if he was doing that day one white dude would have just got he would have been bankrupt within his first ten minutes yep so it’s a really good point that I like that and then the second question is what you’re seeing you’ve been in the consulting community for as long as anyone else because you’ve been you’re like one of my day one customers I’m pretty sure since 2014 so like you’ve seen a lot of what goes on in there what would be your number one piece of advice for other members good question so I don’t know there be one piece but you know a few pieces you know for one you know get an itch quick and and leverage something that works right some think like for me the first niche I worked with wasn’t you know yeah you don’t have to be married to the niche I think that’s a lot of people they look at the niche and they assume that’s like they’re they’re signing like a lifelong contract it’s not a lifelong contract and so you can’t get any feedback unless you try so I think a lot of people spend way too much time in the niche selection phase trying to get that perfect and it’s not going to be perfect so pick a niche quickly so you can start getting to work you know don’t just like throw a dart at the board but you know set a time limit you know give yourself like a week at the most and be like a within a week I’m gonna I’m gonna get this thing done the next thing you know would be that I mean once you’ve got that you know put a very solid plan of attack you need to be spending the vast majority of time you know interact with that mark learning from the market understanding their problems and you’ll understand their problems by talking to them like I see people that will say oh they’ll have a co someone but they almost want to qualify the call they’re like well I wanted to fill out a survey to direct outreach the only thing you want to do is talk to somebody so they can start telling you things because all the best copy all the best messages I didn’t make them up other people told them to me I’m phone calls right and so that’s where you really figure out what’s going on in the market what people are saying and then you can that’s like basically what you need right there is those two pieces is just get into the niche find out the problems they’ll tell them to you and then formulate that into your offer and then if you’re you know whatever you’re doing leverage some leverage something that will get you the result you know so anything you can leverage do it because if you try to invent invent the market invent the solution you know you’re gonna you’re gonna fall hard and fast and you’ll get discouraged and so focusing on leveraging you know 90% of something that works already you’re going to lower your odds of failure but still have you know an edge so those would be the things just don’t just sit there you know get to work get to work quickly know that you can pivot I mean we’ve pivoted dozens of times I’m sure you pivoted many more than that in your own business but the important thing is get the boat moving so that you know it’s like there’s guys that like my analogies they sit in the speedboat and they’re like trying before they even go one inch forward they’re trying to get it perfectly pointed you know at the island they’re going to you know when in reality you know the guy that’s already gone 100 miles the wrong direction will get there after even with all the wrong you know all the going out of his way and the wrong direction he’ll still get there before the other guy even turns his engine on starts going forward that’s the same type of thing is that the movement creates feedback which creates the information to make the pivots to what will work and the people that succeed they do a lot they implement they don’t just sit there thinking and I spent way too much of my life thinking and not enough time doing on the stuff and so don’t think yourself out of taking action because you can’t think yourself out of a mistake you have to make some mistakes got it it’s good advice and then where can people learn more about you what’s a good place for them to go yeah so a couple places you can go you can find me on Facebook if you search for me in the group you know Josh Harris I’m right there I’m fairly active on that our current site right now you can check out his agency growth secrets calm and that has information about us and what we do sets agency growth secrets and so those are the two places you can connect with me on Facebook are there and yeah that’s it awesome well thanks thought for jumping on and sharing your story I’m sure it’s going to help a lot of people in the group and also probably inspire a lot of people to to get started and business for themselves as well perfect it was a lot of fun kawin speak soon

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